Speed Sign Recognition - Not working as advertised

[Graham B]

1 hour ago, unofix said:

Very good if only ............

There is something about the font of that 120 sign that makes me think its working in KM even though I can see your dash is set to miles.

I think to use a technical term your system is fubar !!

Elsewhere it gives the correct limit (When it works) so it is working in mph - or should I say it is working in MPH most of the time? Even if it was KPH, 70 odd MPH is way off of the mark.

[Mark-UK]

2 hours ago, Graham B said:

Just for amusement, here's a photo of my car stopped in Tenterden High Street (30mph limit) with the dash indicating the limit is 120mph.

 

 

I can see your car has major electrical problems as the stop start light is green instead of the standard not working grey 🤣

[DaveT70]

17 hours ago, unofix said:

Hi Dave, I've followed your instructions and pleased to report AHB installed (see photo) and as far as I can tell it is working (will take the car out tonight for a full test). The AHB symbol comes up on the dash when the headlight come on, so just need to check the HB switches on when I'm doing more than 30MPH.

Couple of odd random things happened while I did the update.  The AutoLock option to switch it off disappeared from the Locks option on the display, although autolocking was still working. I had to go back in to the IPC module and turn it back to 'Enabled' and it now seems to be back and working OK.  Now for the crazzy one I now have in the 'Chimes' option a 'Parking Space found' (see photo) my car does not have self park so no idea what it is.

🤔Did you stick to the codes (Asbuilt) or did you do some as drop down options when configuring?

Drop downs can switch other stuff on too.

Did you reset all modules that you had changed configuration after completion?

[unofix]

2 hours ago, DaveT70 said:

Did you stick to the codes (Asbuilt)

Hi Dave, I did all the changes using just the codes. Its a couple of months now since I originally turned on the Auto Locking and added the option to the dashboard menu which I did add using the drop down menu on ForScan. I can't think what might have caused it to vanish, but it's back now and seems ok.

The parking space thing in the chimes option is new, never seen that before, and no idea what it is. I've left the box ticked to see if anything ever happens but I don't expect it will.

Last night I took the car out in the dark to test the AHB, which worked excellently, it faded on and off and was fast to react to other vehicles, so a very good upgrade - Thanks 👍

[unofix]

Oh nearly forgot, No I didn't reset any of the modules after I made the changes. Should I have done ?

[DaveT70]

4 hours ago, unofix said:

Oh nearly forgot, No I didn't reset any of the modules after I made the changes. Should I have done ?

They recommend to, but. it's working OK, I wouldn't bother going back in.

Glad it's all working OK, I was really pleased to finally get it working, took two years of research 

[Graham B]

On 7/5/2021 at 8:18 PM, Wino said:

Mine shows 70/60 for national speed limits depending on what road I'm on but never has shown a national speed limit sign.

As for overhead matrix I'm not so sure as I don't go on motorways that often but I'm heading out tomorrow and will purposely go via the M1 under the matrix signs and see.

Did you check to see if it worked with motorway matrix signs?

[unofix]

16 minutes ago, Graham B said:

motorway matrix signs

Mine does not see or react to the matrix signs placed in the central resavation area. I can't say about the overhead ones as there are very few near me and they have always been off when I've gone under them.

I did think mine showed the National Speed limit sign but I must have been wrong as the last few times I've been out it has only shown 60 or 70

[Nimrodmk8]

On 12/28/2020 at 9:34 PM, Guy Heaton said:

I think Speed sign is great but frankly if it isnt working 100% its pointless.  I know the highway code so I don't need it.

Mine is sometimes blank, for me I'm not too bothered, I just look a the road signs.

[mjt]

40 minutes ago, Nimrodmk8 said:

I just look a the road signs

There is a strong argument in favour of keeping your eyes on what's ouside the car rather than being distracted by information screens inside.

[Graham B]

Well the car spent another day in the garage with a Ford technical expert and they changed the camera. The result? No change 😒 I've also had a holiday which meant I had the pleasure of the M25. That confirmed that, despite Ford technical saying the camera wouldn't "see" the overhead matrix limit signs, it did! Sadly it also picked up some random signs from somewhere, the worst being 10mph! I'm glad I'd turned off the "intelligent" system. Just for the hell of it I've added photos I took yesterday when I picked up the car with it displaying 60mph and 120mph in a 30mph limit. It also still goes blank whenever I turn at a junction.

More concerning is that, despite leaving the EU, we are still going to be subject to their dafter ideas and it seems that this kind of speed limiter will become mandatory on all new cars from 2022. 

My latest e-mail to the Ford customer relationship centre suggests that we agree it's not fit for purpose and we start talking about compensation. 

 

[unofix]

2 hours ago, Graham B said:

that this kind of speed limiter will become mandatory on all new cars from 2022. 

It will be intresting to see what happens when say the system malfunctions on a motorway and thinks its a 10MPH limit, suddenly reduces the speed of the vehicle and causes a major accident. Who will be held responsible ?

There is a stretch of road near me with a 60MPH limit, but just off to the side is the entrance of a quarry which has a 10MPH limit sign just inside there gate. Each time I pass it my car suddenly changes the displayed limit to 10MPH and then after about 200 yards it changes it back to 60MPH. I'm thankfull that the car at least does't have the ability to slam the brakes on !!

[Eric Bloodaxe]

1 hour ago, unofix said:

There is a stretch of road near me with a 60MPH limit, but just off to the side is the entrance of a quarry which has a 10MPH limit sign just inside there gate. Each time I pass it my car suddenly changes the displayed limit to 10MPH and then after about 200 yards it changes it back to 60MPH. I'm thankfull that the car at least does't have the ability to slam the brakes on !!

Very similar location and effect on a road drive I regularly, though the side road is a 30.

Another one is a pair of NSL signs coming out of a 40, where the black diagonal has faded completely, leaving just a,white circle,which the camera obviously can't detect, so display keeps showing 40.

Fortunately, like yours, the system in my car is "information only".

 

[Graham B]

Everyone needs to report these problems to Ford. Only then will they do something.

[Guy Heaton]

What can Ford or any maker do for some of these?  If the road signage itself is incorrect?  Computers are dumb.  Garbage in, garbage out.

[DaveT70]

12 hours ago, Graham B said:

Everyone needs to report these problems to Ford. Only then will they do something.

They know

[Eric Bloodaxe]

5 hours ago, Guy Heaton said:

What can Ford or any maker do for some of these?  If the road signage itself is incorrect?  Computers are dumb.  Garbage in, garbage out.

Yes, in fairness to Ford and manufacturers in general, these systems rely on a mix of cameras and GPS so if road signs are incorrect, missing or obscured and/or GPS is not up to date, they're not going to work.

If anything, the fault lies with the legislators who dream up these "safety measures" and the authorities who fail to maintain signage and GPS data.

I've posted this elewhere, but these were the 30 signs on the approach to my village. They've recently been relocated to a spot where they can actually be seen after several complaints by a "concerned resident"!😃

 

[Graham B]

23 hours ago, Eric Bloodaxe said:

Yes, in fairness to Ford and manufacturers in general, these systems rely on a mix of cameras and GPS so if road signs are incorrect, missing or obscured and/or GPS is not up to date, they're not going to work.

If anything, the fault lies with the legislators who dream up these "safety measures" and the authorities who fail to maintain signage and GPS data.

I've posted this elewhere, but these were the 30 signs on the approach to my village. They've recently been relocated to a spot where they can actually be seen after several complaints by a "concerned resident"!😃

 

I understand that no system is going to replace the Mk1 eyeball but, if I'm being charitable, my system is wrong 80-90% of the time. 

[unofix]

1 hour ago, Graham B said:

my system is wrong 80-90% of the time. 

You need to have a positive outlook - Your system is correct 10-20% of the time  🤣

[Graham B]

Well, today after lots of tooing and froing I got the following e-mail;

"On vehicles equipped with Etis minor feature codes  (LESS SPEED SIGN RECOGNITION) +  (INTELLIGENT SPEED ASSISTANCE ) the traffic sign recognition is limited to camera vision only. This can lead to a blank display if no speed signs are recognised by camera. The sign can go away in the cluster after a certain distance of driving without seeing a new sign or repetition of the old or after a turn / roundabout. The distance may vary depending on the speed limit value and vehicle speed. Also Implicit national Speed limits cannot be shown e.g. passing a city entrance/ exit sign may lead to no speed limit display. This is design intent behaviour."

My reply was as follows;

 

"Thank you for your e-mail below.

To be clear, your technical department are confirming that it is designed to work this badly?

If that is the case, I would contend that it falls foul of the consumer rights act 2015. This would appear to be very clear. The system is not “satisfactory”, not “as described” and is demonstrably not “fit for purpose”. To be clear, I do not wish to take this route but you appear to be giving me little choice."

Madness.

[unofix]

Yesterday I had for no reason that I could see, had the speed sign suddely change from 60 to 100MPH.

After about 20 seconds it changed back to 60. The thing was when this happened I had not seen any road signs, so what caused the change is anyone guess.

[Graham B]

19 hours ago, unofix said:

Yesterday I had for no reason that I could see, had the speed sign suddely change from 60 to 100MPH.

After about 20 seconds it changed back to 60. The thing was when this happened I had not seen any road signs, so what caused the change is anyone guess.

I could live with that. My wife's Fiesta has the camera linked to the sat nav data and it occasionally does the same thing. How they think mine is acceptable is beyond me. More often than not, it's blank.

[unofix]

Hi Graham, I must admit my car which is a very similar model to yours is right about 80% of the time. One problem that it does have that it sees speed signs on factory gates and on side roads which it then displays.

I have read with intrest the replies you have had from Ford "Technical" (God help us!). They state the car does not GPS information which I find hard to believe. I'm fairly sure that my car must be using some sort of addtional information other that the camera.

There is a road near me which was all 60 MPH with the normal 'National' speed limit sign. My car always displayed 60 as it should have. Last year the local council made a section of the road 40MPH and put up new signs. Now heres the bit I don't understand. My car shows the 60 limit as normal, then I drive past the new clearly marked 40 limit. The speed sign on my instrument cluster changes to show 40. All good and as you would expect. THEN.... about 300 yards past the new sign my car then changes the speed sign back to 60. This is not a one off thing, it does it every day. There are no other signs so nothing for it to mis-read. It seems to me that the car is using data from the Satnav which still thinks the road is all 60MPH.

[Alex.S]

All I have is data from satnav. Apple maps is more accurate. Wouldn’t bother me so much if I wasn’t paying £3.50 a month for this inaccurate information! Anyway my local supermarket car Park is a 60 limit or so it seems so not breaking the law whilst up there doing donuts 

[Graham B]

Well, it looks like I've reached the end of the road with Ford Customer Relations. The final statement from their technical department reads;

“On vehicles equipped with Etis minor feature codes  (LESS SPEED SIGN RECOGNITION) +  (INTELLIGENT SPEED ASSISTANCE ) the traffic sign recognition is limited to camera vision only. This can lead to a blank display if no speed signs are recognised by camera. The sign can go away in the cluster after a certain distance of driving without seeing a new sign or repetition of the old or after a turn / roundabout. The distance may vary depending on the speed limit value and vehicle speed. Also Implicit national Speed limits cannot be shown e.g. passing a city entrance/ exit sign may lead to no speed limit display. This is design intent behaviour.”

Whilst I'm minded to claim via the Consumer Rights Act, I have to claim against the dealer and doubt I'll get anywhere.

How does a Luddite like me turn on the link to the Sat Nav data?